Religion & Education

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Religion & Education Empty Religion & Education

Post by Bob Boblo on Sat Sep 27, 2008 5:53 pm

Ip Lockard: This was split from a previous topic at the most relevant point.
Please continue the discussion here.


William of Orange wrote:
Squiddy wrote:Have you never noticed the simple correlation: the more religion has to do with anything, the worse it is?
No, the results speak for themselves and church schools are the best free ones around. Have you ever visited one?

I have no problem with church schools, they are right for some people, but similarly state schools are right for some people. Having one over the other makes no sense.
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Post by Squiddy on Sat Sep 27, 2008 5:53 pm

"The results"

Can we see any form of proof/substantial amount of evidence, or this just going to be another fact creation match? Razz
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Post by Squiddy on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:16 am

So, how do we move on from this clearly snail paced situation, do we need to propose this in congress, for a new Minister of Education?
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Post by malta_1990 on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:29 am

In my opinion, this system is pointless and horribly time wasting. It wastes the time of the "lecturers" involved and the "students" have a real life after all and learning and taking exams about just a game is useless and pointless.
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Post by emilycvalentine on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:35 am

I think it takes some of the fun out, I imagine a lot of us here are students (based on the ages shown) or have just come out of education; we don't need to play games about learning and taking tests as well. Skills increase the more we work so surely the idea of getting better jobs by going the the eUK education system is pointless.
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Post by malta_1990 on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:38 am

Exactly, I'm a student and frankly I'm worried that people less responsible than myself will ruin their real life futures by studying for a game test instead of focusing on their studies and I will not stand by and see this happening!
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Post by Deilos on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:39 am

I think that this should be separate from congress; it's too big to sort out in one proposal. Congress should approve a broad proposal saying that a board of education will be formed to decide on creating a university for the people, then we get our own forum section to sort things out in. When we've done so, congress passes the law again with details on the whole system. The latter proposal could just go straight to voting, I reckon; no need to discuss it in congress as it's merely getting a seal of approval.

This wouldn't be compulsory; people who take these are people who are willing to put more time into Erepublik and want to become ministers etc. If you do want to become a minister, or head of paratroopers or whatever, then you're obviously going to be putting much more time into the game than if you don't. So it makes sense that if you're willing to do this, you're willing to put enough time into doing this course.
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Post by emilycvalentine on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:43 am

But people are then likely to feel pressured into taking the exams and going to the eUni so they can get the most out of eRep - it amy also put off new users because they will see the words 'exams' and 'tests'
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Post by malta_1990 on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:48 am

It also does not make sense because people are picked as Ministers after being in the game for a while and they would know all the stuff you plan to teach anyway, and don't forget that most of them would have been apprentices anyway. Same with the Military.
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Post by Deilos on Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:51 am

But it wouldn't necessarily be about the exams. Yes, there would be one at the end of the course; but it would be pretty easy if you've read the stuff. Anyway, I know that I personally would want to take part in some of the courses, especially the economics and history courses. So I really want this...

Malta; just because people have been in the game a long time doesn't mean they know everything. They may not have paid attention to everything. Besides, the general course would show them where they want to go, which is definitely helpful. If you find out what you're good at fairly early on, then you can start learning about it. Nobody is born into Erepublik knowing about everything, and it would definitely be helpful to take the Core Studies course at first. Perhaps that one could be much less intensive, and not have an exam at the end just have a few basic questions as 'homework' throughout the lessons, then the teacher decides at the end if you've understood everything.
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Post by Squiddy on Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:31 am

You realise of course that you could probably be "taught" the whole of erep history in a little under 2 - 3 hours. Do you really, really, believe that's going to make people fail in their real life studies??!!

Only the truly mindless would feel they "have" to take and pass these tests, that's just a stupid thing to say IMO, that people would feel pressured into doing them.
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Post by emilycvalentine on Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:47 am

If it leads to better pay and better jobs then those who have not done the courses will be missing out. If it can be taught in a matter of hours then why is there talk of homework, essays and other assessments?
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Post by funky44 on Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:53 am

Meh, work with a gradual system:
Post topics with tutorials in it.
Lvl1 point to 2 topics and have user read it.
After having read the threads he can do the exam (which is a topic with his answers on a previously decided questions) Mod reads it, deletes topic and gives user to lvl2.
Repeat this till the appropriate levels. Give user something after finishing eUni.
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Post by twaters on Sun Sep 28, 2008 7:02 am

Squiddy wrote:"The results"

Can we see any form of proof/substantial amount of evidence, or this just going to be another fact creation match? Razz

Says he who also made an unsubstantiated claim....

The academy that Dawkins is so heavily bent upon slating (set up by Peter Vardy, a Christian) received exam results within the top 5 comprehensive schools in the UK (Aug '06) in an extremely poor area.


Back on topic, I don't think there will be any 'pressure' for people to learn a bit about the eUK, it will be purely of interest, and we could always remove 'exams' in these cases and simply have a course that people follow.
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Post by Sir Graystar on Sun Sep 28, 2008 9:34 am

Sorry Squiddy, they're right. Faith schools tend to get good marks. However, you could argue its because the majority of them have entrance exams, small classes and you have to pay to go to them. I always find that helps the old test scores.
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Post by Enef Freestar on Sun Sep 28, 2008 9:41 am

Sir Graystar wrote:Sorry Squiddy, they're right. Faith schools tend to get good marks. However, you could argue its because the majority of them have entrance exams, small classes and you have to pay to go to them. I always find that helps the old test scores.

I go to a faith school and we all we simply pay is 10 a month or something becuase the govt. only funds faith school 90% of what they fund state schools. Most of my classes have about 30 people in them and my school had no entrance exams. Yet we are still one of the best schools around, what is it? (By the way I dont follow the faith anymore im athiest now Smile )
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Post by Deilos on Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:21 am

emilycvalentine wrote:If it leads to better pay and better jobs then those who have not done the courses will be missing out. If it can be taught in a matter of hours then why is there talk of homework, essays and other assessments?

1) The idea of it leading to better jobs and pay was just that, an idea. I think we scrapped that a while ago. It only leads to better government roles, which are only for those who are really interested and don't pay in monetary terms.

2) It could be taught via messenger in a matter of hours, certainly, but in most cases students would be taught in a similar way to how Funky said, with 'lessons' being wrote, them reading them and responding to some questions, then the next lesson performed in the same way. The Core Studies would be a lot lighter, while specialised degrees could involve essays and much more in-depth 'homework' questions.
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Post by Brian Boru on Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:56 pm

"Faith" doesn't determine the intelligence of students.

"Faith" is generally a negative factor in intelligence, considering the overwhelming number of top intellectuals are atheists.
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Post by William of Orange on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:06 pm

Brian Boru wrote:"Faith" is generally a negative factor in intelligence, considering the overwhelming number of top intellectuals are atheists.
Now the burden of proof falls to you, Mr Boru.
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Post by Brian Boru on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:15 pm

William of Orange wrote:
Brian Boru wrote:"Faith" is generally a negative factor in intelligence, considering the overwhelming number of top intellectuals are atheists.
Now the burden of proof falls to you, Mr Boru.

With pleasure.

Surveys conducted in the US and the UK in top academies and universities showed that something like 8% and 7% respectively believed in a personal God, and 60%+ didn't believe in God at all. The top intellectuals of the academies/unversities were even more atheistic.

I'll find you the links as soon as I can find my copy of the God Delusion that has them.


Last edited by Brian Boru on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by William of Orange on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:20 pm

Brian Boru wrote:I'll find you the links as soon as I can find my copy of the Gold Delusion that has them.
That would be preferable to you expecting me to take your heathen word for it.
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Post by Brian Boru on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:22 pm

William of Orange wrote:
Brian Boru wrote:I'll find you the links as soon as I can find my copy of the Gold Delusion that has them.
That would be preferable to you expecting me to take your heathen word for it.
Well, you seem to take the words of clergymen, the only difference between myself and them is that I know what I'm talking about, and I don't molest little kids.
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Post by William of Orange on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:24 pm

Brian Boru wrote:Well, you seem to take the words of clergymen, the only difference between myself and them is that I know what I'm talking about, and I don't molest little kids.
You're thinking of your own clergymen there son. We read the Bible for ourselves and believe in the Priesthood of all believers.
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Post by Hassan Pesearn on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:25 pm

Oh dear.

This is getting horribly off topic, can we just talk about things that are related to the title, at least? Rather than just insult each others views...
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Post by Sir Graystar on Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:25 pm

Enef Freestar wrote:I go to a faith school and we all we simply pay is 10 a month or something becuase the govt. only funds faith school 90% of what they fund state schools. Most of my classes have about 30 people in them and my school had no entrance exams. Yet we are still one of the best schools around, what is it? (By the way I dont follow the faith anymore im athiest now Smile )
Then I guess your lucky. Me, I have to go to boring old state school. Mind you, we got the best state school GSCE results in Wales...
Brian Boru wrote:"Faith" is generally a negative factor in intelligence, considering the overwhelming number of top intellectuals are atheists.
I think its more people with faith can be limited by what they believe, and some can be narrow-minded. I'm sure there are planty of smart vicars out there, who could have been university proffessors if they hadn't been religious.
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